User:GiverOfThePeace/Puella Magi Misconceptions

Introduction

This is going to be a pretty quick blog dealing with refuting the inaccuracies that are brought about by Madoka scaling. It won't be too long since there's not much to tackle. I'll be using mainly VsBattles pages as most arguments I've seen regarding the scaling comes from there.

Do not take blogs from this wiki and try to use them on other wikis for upgrades or downgrades, the standards and practices we accept on this wiki is not the same as other wikis so taking what we say and applying it to another wiki isn't exactly the best practice. This blog is purely for this wiki and follows its standards.

Misconceptions

Madoka Kaname

"Moon level as Doppel Kriemhild Gretchen (Her Doppel can level the Earth and then reduce it all to dust)"

This one just confuses me completely, it's directly noted that the doppel levels the Earth and reduces it all to dust, why is this just not Planetary...? Especially when Madoka's witch sucks the entire Earth into her bewitched space.

So the most popular feat for Ultimate Madoka is this: "Completely reformed the multiverse, which is stated to be made of infinite universes, from destroying the concept of Witches in every universe, past and future. Ascended to a higher level of existence to become a conceptual entity as the Law of Cycles itself, which encompasses the multiverse as well as the nonexistent multiverse beyond it."

It's kind of funny to me how people will use this and always use this argument but then ignore that there's context behind all of this. Madoka did not destroy or erase the concept of Witches, what she did was go to each point in time and stop a magical girl from becoming a witch. She "erase the concept" in the fact that the concept could never be explored as no one ever turns into a witch since Madoka is always stopping magical girls from becoming witches, it'd be like me committing mass genocide on an entire race of people, destroying all of their history, culture, etcetera, thus making it where there's no on that remembers that species, I essentially "erased the concept" of that species. It's why it's directly noted that witches CAN still exist. https://wiki.puella-magi.net/The_Rebellion_Story/Q%26A

"Q: How is it possible that Homura turns into a witch?

A: Remember Madoka's wish was to take away the curse before each Mahou Shoujo gets consumed by it and turns into a witch. That prevents the process of turning into one, and thus also elimates the existence of witches. In other words, it is still possible to turn into a witch, but it has not happened, or been observed, because Godoka interferes before it happening. Thus no one knows about it, except for Homura and QB. QB only knows about it because Homura vaguely remembers it from the previous world, and told QB about it at the end of the tv series."

It's funny to me too because the scan I just sent is one of the scans used for this argument of multiversal Madoka on I believe Homura Akemi's page.

There's another interview also that directly shows Madoka wasn't really affecting the whole universe or world in the way people think, just anything to do with the Maho Shojo: https://wiki.puella-magi.net/Madoka_Magica_Episode_12:_My_Very_Best_Friend "Next, Yuuki asks about Madoka's wish: do they think that it's 'correct'? Urobuchi says that he can't say it's not right; it's quite something for a middle school girl. Aoki says that Madoka was able to really gather a lot of experiences together before making her decision.

Urobuchi then cuts in saying that he really wanted to have that scene where Mami gives Madoka her sketches back.

Miyamoto really liked her wish. She really isn't saving the whole universe or the world, just the mahou shoujo. Yuuki thought that without Homura, they couldn't have had this wish.

Urobuchi then talked about the scene with Madoka saving all the girls. "Was it okay to do something this flashy?" Saitou then says that before this she hadn't considered that there were magical girls all over the world. Urobuchi says "Kyubey is world-wide."

It's amazing though, she's saving every magical girl not just around the world but the past and the future. Madoka really has a lot of work to do!"

"Urobuchi states in the commentary that Madoka erased the existence of Witches but did not erase curses themselves."

There's also no nonexistent multiverse, I don't know where this idea came from.

"Causality Manipulation, Void Manipulation, Existence Erasure (Able to erase beings, including the likes of Ultimate Kriemhild Gretchen),"

This of course meets the exact same issue, she's not actually erasing anyone, all she did was destroy Kriemhild Gretchen, and even then, Gretchen just hid in Homura's shield.

"Immunity to Soul Manipulation (Doesn't have a soul),"

From what I remember, Ultimate Madoka still had a soul gem, so I went to check, and funninly enough there's an ultimate Madoka soul gem merchandise, and then I checked her page and her soul gem is located below her throat, so yeah she does have a soul.

"Unconventional Resistance to Power Absorption and Memory Manipulation (If her powers or memories are stolen they will either take control of the opponent or manifest as a separate being)."

Don't really understand this one cause the entire ending of Rebellion is Homura stole Ultimate Madoka's powers and memories but it didn't take control of Homura or manifest as a separate being, so this is weird.

"Omnipresent (Exists as a concept throughout the entire Puella Magi multiverse. Can also manifest outside the timelines and in the nonexistent multiverse)"

First part is correct, second part is wrong because there is no nonexistent multiverse.

Also fun fact unrelated to most of this, Ultimate Madoka isn't every Madoka in existence being erased, other Madoka's still exist, along with a side story in Magia Record having Ultimate Madoka viewing a timeline that has her alternate self. So she is not a multiversal singularity, only a singulartiy within her universe.

Kriemhild Gretchen

"Multiverse level+ (Should be far stronger than the peak of Avatar of Calamity as she's implied to be made of all the curses, which would include also the Avatar of Calamity)"

It's kind of funny how this scan further proves the concept of witches weren't erased cause the Spindle Witch is literally a witch that Madoka couldn't purify since it was in Homura's shield. Also this scan isn't from the official translation, here is the page of the official translation, it notes that the Avatar of Calamity would bring an end of the world and notes the Wraith World will soon end the way as the old world did, since the old world did not get nuked on a multiversal scale, that's not what this is talking about. This is talking about how the wraith world is going to be a world filled with grief and despair against, like how the witch world was and what Wals did to the world in the witch timeline.

"Nonexistent Physiology (Nature Type 1, Aspect Type 1, 2 and 5. As a witch, she lacks a soul. Was able to appear in Ultimate Madoka's new universe despite the new law she applied prevented the concept of Witches from existing from every universe, even the past and future. Stated to be made of the despair of the Puella Magis, which is what transforms them to Witches),"

Witches do not lack souls, this comes from a misunderstanding a when a magical girl's soul gem becomes completely corrupted, their soul gets destroyed, because it looks like their soul gem gets destroyed, but their soul gems just transform into grief seeds. They still have a soul.

Kriemhild Gretchen was able to appear in Madoka's new universe because she hid within Homura's shield. When the Wraiths absorbed Homura's power, it re-released Kriemhild back into the world through the Spindle Witch. Now this is me assuming they're talking about after she was defeated by Ultimate Madoka and the manga part, but if they're talking about the anime where Ultimate Madoka goes to fight her, that's because the wish is specifically Madoka herself comes to stop magical girls from becoming witches, this is her own witch, so she must fight it. Kriemhild Gretchen is not really nonexistent at all.

"Regeneration (High-Godly. Even after Ultimate Madoka erased her, she was able to return, making Madoka unable to permanently defeat her)"

Madoka did not erase Kriemhild, she one-shotted her, the idea that she erased her is from the same misconception that she erased the concept of witches when she didn't.

" Resistance to: Conceptual Manipulation (Type 1), Law Manipulation (Was able to manifest after Madoka destroyed witches on a conceptual level and the Law of Cycles was preventing her existence, although she was still affected in the end), "

Going through different points in time on an omnipresent scale to stop magical girls from becoming witches through taking them into the law of cycles before they turn into a witch is not destroying witches on a conceptual level. The Law of Cycles was not preventing Kriemhild's existence either, from what I can remember that's never once mentioned.

"resistance to most, if not all Ultimate Madoka's offensive abilities"

This one confuses me to no end cause Madoka one-shotted Kriemhild at the end of the anime. What exactly are they resisting?

Homura Akemi

"Acausality (Type 4. Transcended the laws of the world)"

Alright this one just confuses me to no end, the scan being used is a clear fan translation, the official translation instead notes Maodka and Homura overcame the laws of the world, and what this contextually is talking about is the full context here, that Madoka and Homura's desire with each other created a miracle that overcame the laws of the world, not that Homura herself transcends the laws of the world.

Conclusion

If you have any issues with this blog and want to list your long refutes, I'd suggest joining the discord to discuss it, as conversations over blogs aren't at all a great place to discuss topics like these that obviously will be talked about in circles.

I'll also not being replying to any off-site "refutes" to my blog unless I really feel like it, this blog is for this site, if a person has an issue with it I've provided two ways to discuss it with me.